Next year

[fufanatic]

I guess all those HS Sr's excitedly posting their acceptance letters on Twitter is fake news.

I personally think students are super pumped to go to Furman. I see all the Instagram posts, Twitter posts, etc. It makes me so proud as an alum because I remember how excited I was when my letter came in the mail in the early winter of 2004. I was excited about the prospect of following the sports teams as a student, but I'm not sure how many incoming students feel the same way.

[FU03times]

The great location of Furman definitely comes with its ups and downs. Yes, we can attract students from various locations with different tastes and interests...but once people get here they want to explore...and since the whole week students are in class and Sundays are for brunch and studying, the only day to explore is sadly Saturday aka the best day of the week aka GAMEDAY. I do not have a solution for the problem and I’ve been in discussions with students, staff, and BR on how we can attract more students to the games but it’s harder to do this when Saturday is not the designated day to go to a Furman sports game in the spring like it is in the fall with football. In the fall students who go out of town on fridays drive back early in the morning on saturdays just to make it to the tailgates and the game. If they can show up there, then they can definitely show up to the hoops games. But it just hasn’t become a habit....YET!

[greenvegas]

Hey Fessor. Are you still heartbroken over that oh so close Wofford loss that eliminated the Terriers in the Tourney? Hey everybody. Fessor is actually a Wofford fan.

[Fessor]

I guess all those HS Sr's excitedly posting their acceptance letters on Twitter is fake news.

Well, in many instances, Furman isn't getting it's first choice either.

BTW, you've seen 2700 acceptance letters posted? Unless you've seen a representative sample, then, yes, it's the definition of fake news.

The school's academic reputation has dropped considerably. Even internally, we consider ourselves in the same peer group as Elon (i.e., we're competing with Elon for students), something that would have been unheard of 30 years ago.

[Mr. Taggart]

Elon has vastly improved its national standing over the last 20 years.

We are about where we were, a tick behind the top national liberal arts schools -- Davidson, Washington and Lee, Williams, etc.

I tend to agree with CharlieFU that a lot of our change has been that we are not an aspirational school for many of the people who traditionally had Furman ties. Many of the problems we argue about are national trends in higher education -- namely the current view that it is a commodity, rather than a good for its own sake. This is a national trend. That has hurt higher ed everywhere, and I have discussed it with faculty members at universities throughout our area. We need to build on our identity, and be comfortable with what we are, and what we are not.

[MNORM]

Interesting post on the Samford forum. http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/02/grand-c ... an-majerle

Lot of interesting info in there. Coordinated efforts by the students and administration to make the basketball games the go-to social event on campus. Efforts by the administration to understand what drives a student to want to go to a basketball game.

In terms of a student body, GCU is much different than Furman. Still, when was the last time our administration asked the students what it would take to get them to a basketball game (I genuinely don't know)?

Good read. Certainly helps to have the 19,500 students compared to 2,700, but with 3K students at every game, Furman would have to average like 400 students to have same ratio. That ain't happening currently. At the end of the day you either need a ton of students that like basketball, have school spirit or like to be at can't-miss events on campus. Probably a combination of all three is occurring at Grand Canyon and would need to happen at Furman for student support to increase.

Basketball attendance may be symptomatic of a larger, more pernicious problem: that Furman is essentially a commuter school (home or elsewhere on weekends) and largely comprised of students who are not attending their first choice of institutions. I wonder if these may be the dirty secrets that aren't shared when alums are solicited for donations.

This was NOT the situation when I was at Furman (94-98). I hardly knew anyone who left the area on weekends. Is this really what Furman has become? I came to Furman from 600 miles away, and it was my first choice...in fact, I only applied to three schools - Furman and my two back-ups. I have a hard time believing that the student body has changed much, other than how wealthy they are...this is undeniable.

[gman]

Furman is not a commuter school. I don't think most students consider Furman as their second or third choice either. The main issue is that most students have followed larger school sports most of their lives. I have told the story about my son several times. He graduated in 2010. The first night he was on campus, the freshmen on the hall floor had a meet and greet social. The subject got around to favorite college sports teams. The answer from every student was one of the big teams like Florida, Georgia, Clemson, Carolina, etc. When my son said, "Furman of course", they were puzzled. Sadly, during his 4 years at Furman, the football and basketball teams struggled, therefore, the students never became invested in any of the sports programs. Many of those Furman graduates are still not invested in any of the sports teams. That trend has continued, contributing to the drop in attendance at football and basketball games. I keep thinking winning will help with basketball attendance, but that was not the case this year. The marketing department, if we have one, has to do a better job of getting them involved. Our older folks need to shut up about the loud music too. Attendance for our players and coaches is embarrassing. I sometimes wonder how we get any recruit excited about playing in front of so few fans. We need to make Timmons the toughest and loudest arena in college basketball. The administration has to know that the money making sport for a school the size of Furman is basketball. If they don't get that, we are doomed to fail. I am not going to give up. I will support the team through the Paladin Club, the Roundball Club and as a season ticket holder. I will continue to send the coaches and the players words and notes of encouragement. Go Paladins!

[The Jackal]

Interesting post on the Samford forum. http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/02/grand-c ... an-majerle

Lot of interesting info in there. Coordinated efforts by the students and administration to make the basketball games the go-to social event on campus. Efforts by the administration to understand what drives a student to want to go to a basketball game.

In terms of a student body, GCU is much different than Furman. Still, when was the last time our administration asked the students what it would take to get them to a basketball game (I genuinely don't know)?

Good read. Certainly helps to have the 19,500 students compared to 2,700, but with 3K students at every game, Furman would have to average like 400 students to have same ratio. That ain't happening currently. At the end of the day you either need a ton of students that like basketball, have school spirit or like to be at can't-miss events on campus. Probably a combination of all three is occurring at Grand Canyon and would need to happen at Furman for student support to increase.

Basketball attendance may be symptomatic of a larger, more pernicious problem: that Furman is essentially a commuter school (home or elsewhere on weekends) and largely comprised of students who are not attending their first choice of institutions. I wonder if these may be the dirty secrets that aren't shared when alums are solicited for donations.

This was NOT the situation when I was at Furman (94-98). I hardly knew anyone who left the area on weekends. Is this really what Furman has become? I came to Furman from 600 miles away, and it was my first choice...in fact, I only applied to three schools - Furman and my two back-ups. I have a hard time believing that the student body has changed much, other than how wealthy they are...this is undeniable.

Nah. One person argues from an unrepresentative sample while criticizing others from arguing from an unrepresentative sample.

[fufanatic]

Furman is not a commuter school. I don't think most students consider Furman as their second or third choice either. The main issue is that most students have followed larger school sports most of their lives. I have told the story about my son several times. He graduated in 2010. The first night he was on campus, the freshmen on the hall floor had a meet and greet social. The subject got around to favorite college sports teams. The answer from every student was one of the big teams like Florida, Georgia, Clemson, Carolina, etc. When my son said, "Furman of course", they were puzzled. Sadly, during his 4 years at Furman, the football and basketball teams struggled, therefore, the students never became invested in any of the sports programs. Many of those Furman graduates are still not invested in any of the sports teams. That trend has continued, contributing to the drop in attendance at football and basketball games. I keep thinking winning will help with basketball attendance, but that was not the case this year. The marketing department, if we have one, has to do a better job of getting them involved. Our older folks need to shut up about the loud music too. Attendance for our players and coaches is embarrassing. I sometimes wonder how we get any recruit excited about playing in front of so few fans. We need to make Timmons the toughest and loudest arena in college basketball. The administration has to know that the money making sport for a school the size of Furman is basketball. If they don't get that, we are doomed to fail. I am not going to give up. I will support the team through the Paladin Club, the Roundball Club and as a season ticket holder. I will continue to send the coaches and the players words and notes of encouragement. Go Paladins!

Agreed on all these points. It was the same when I started in 2004 and didn't change through 2008. I knew less than a handful of students that seriously enjoyed going to football and basketball games for the game. We actually had a decent little crew that traveled to virtually every football game in 2005 and sat in the first couple of rows in the student section my entire time. However, I'm not sure if I knew another person in that small group that had grown up a Furman fan like I had. They embraced school spirit when they arrived. Which is awesome. But if you aren't getting students that already like Furman sports, and there's no development of school spirit for the others that attend (organically or threw organized efforts), it's going to make for a pretty small student section.

I'm honestly not sure it's much different at any small school or non-Power 5 school though so I hate to be super critical of just Furman when it happens all over. When I worked at an Atlanta university (not GT), I never met a single student that grew up a fan of that school. Shocker, the student section wasn't great. I can't imagine a whole lot of kids grow up Wofford, PC, East Carolina, etc. fans. Even less of the kids that do actually end up attending there. I don't have an answer. Winning helps, a large student body helps, more students from the local community help, more H.S. athletes that come to college as regular students might help. I don't know.

[PaladinPower]

I see all of the returning starters with the addition of Hunter at the 1 and Mounce at a small 4. To be honest, with the size of Gurley and Slawson I wouldn't mind seeing the strong package with Jalen and Matt both on the floor with the freshmen helping off the bench. Jalen is an astoundingly efficient blocker and rebounder for his limited PT and came on strong towards the end. Needs to get quicker. Both Jean and Hunter will run the point and both Taylor and/or Bothwell will need to step up and play a big role behind Lyons. Then you throw the freakishly athletic Tre Clark in the mix at the 3 with Brown. It's clear FU is going to be much longer than last year which can't hurt.

Overall, with UNCG losing only 2 seniors and Wofford practically losing no one, I see them at the top of the pecking order. Both Mercer and ETSU are losing plenty of seniors and I am unsure about their depth on the roster today. Transfers and Freshmen could certainly help them out. I see us lurking anywhere from 4-6 but could be at the very top for 2019-2020 and beyond depending on the recruiting and development of our freshmen this year. Bob Richey showed great potential this year and being able to retain every single roster spot during a coaching change was key. UTC underwent the change and had to rebuild completely it seems. FUture is bright for the paladins!!

PS if Lyons can quit turning the ball over so much and show some fight like he did against ETSU, he could be an all conference player by his senior year if not next year. Guy will drop 4 three's on you and finally pump and drive to the hole and finish or get fouled.

[Paul C]

PS if Lyons can quit turning the ball over so much and show some fight like he did against ETSU, he could be an all conference player by his senior year if not next year. Guy will drop 4 three's on you and finally pump and drive to the hole and finish or get fouled.

For context Jordan Lyons turnover rate was 18.6%. (per KenPom)

To compare:
Devin Sibley 20.3%.
John Davis 14.4%
Daniel Fowler 14.9%
Francis Alonso 19.8%
Jalan McCloud 21.6%
Desonta Bradford 16.4%

Room for improvement no doubt but not really a weakness either.

I think his biggest area of improvement is shot selection. He could be a 40%+ 3 point shooter by just NOT taking some of the shots he does.

[DungeonRealm]

No doubt Taylor will challenge Hunter for the starting PG role, kid can flat out play and if Lyons beats out Bothwell for starting SG it would make more sense to match-up 6'3 Taylor and 5'11 Lyons on the court together, with 5'11 Hunter and 6'3 Bothwell coming off the bench together for defensive match-up purposes.
Brown, Mounce, Gurley and even Slawson if he comes in ready to contribute are all interchangeable pieces for us at the 3 and 4 spots and give us good length in there that we have not had the past 2 (23 win) seasons, I am excited for that.
Raff and Jalen solid again at the 5 spot.

[PaladinPower]

PS if Lyons can quit turning the ball over so much and show some fight like he did against ETSU, he could be an all conference player by his senior year if not next year. Guy will drop 4 three's on you and finally pump and drive to the hole and finish or get fouled.

For context Jordan Lyons turnover rate was 18.6%. (per KenPom)

To compare:
Devin Sibley 20.3%.
John Davis 14.4%
Daniel Fowler 14.9%
Francis Alonso 19.8%
Jalan McCloud 21.6%
Desonta Bradford 16.4%

Room for improvement no doubt but not really a weakness either.

I think his biggest area of improvement is shot selection. He could be a 40%+ 3 point shooter by just NOT taking some of the shots he does.

I see your point. I just looked at the season stats and Lyons had as many TOs as Fowler and JD while playing around 300+ less minutes so that's where my point came from. I agree his shot selection could certainly use improvement.

[CharlieFU]

What I like about Lyons is that as the season went along he began trying to drive to the basket some--and if he is able to continue that, it will only help him get better shots from perimeter. And he is absolutely FEARLESS!

[FU03times]

In case you haven’t seen it btw, this is where you can donate money for either basketball team or pledge towards the video board!

http://www.furmanpaladins.com/paladin_c ... Excellence

I make little money but I will be donating as much as I can for these guys. They deserve it.