SoCon Thoughts

[The Jackal]

Just read Brian McLaughlin's latest: https://gridironheroics.com/fcs-footbal ... chKy7oty4s

Came across this quote:

But the circular-firing squad thing in the SoCon — which seems to happen just about every year — could doom the league to its automatic berth and maybe only one at-large team.

The SoCon has been committed to a variation of a 9 football team "round robin" for a long while, even in light of the recent machinations in football. But is it costing us?

Every year, several of the premier teams from these other, larger, FCS conferences avoid playing one another. For instance:

• New Hampshire is a bubble team, and will avoid playing top 15 Delaware this season.

• Rhode Island is top 25 and will avoid top 20 Richmond.

• #3 Montana State doesn't play #2 Sacramento State.

• UNI, a bubble team in recent years that's gotten in with 4 losses, doesn't play North Dakota State.

With Jacksonville State moving to FBS and now Kennesaw State, is it time for the SoCon to try and pick off some of the south eastern FCS programs in the now-seemingly unstable ASUN, Big South, OVC, etc?

What happens if one of these lesser FBS conferences comes calling for SoCon Schools? If Kennesaw State gets an FBS bid after averaging close to 5,000 fans at home games, then it seems they'll take just about anyone.

Right now, the other major FCS conferences are playing this game. The SoCon isn't. This feels a bit like the Big 12's "one true champion" approach a number of years ago that seemed to go nowhere.

Are there really enough advantages to having more than 1 or 2 playoff teams to make it worthwhile to add teams?
If we have to add teams, these would appear to be perhaps the best choices, more or less in order of preference:
-Elon (probably not interested)
-Richmond (")
-W&M (")
-Campbell
-NCA&TSU
-Gardner-Webb
-NC Central
-Charleston Southern
-SCSU
-Tennessee Tech
-EKU
-Tennessee State
-North Alabama
-UT-Martin
-Murray State

Couple of thoughts:

The SoCon is in a unique position. Every other FCS conference in the southeast appears to be in some sort of level of instability. The MEAC is losing teams, Big South is losing teams, OVC and Big South are supposed to combine, the ASUN started afresh and has already lost some charter members.

The SoCon has always appeared to like its relatively small footprint and close knit group of schools. We just seem to be a bit of a holdout at the moment in this new age of college football.

I've said this before, but I'd like to see some aggressive consolidation to protect the conference against the next round of nonsense.

For instance,

SoCon East
Furman
Wofford
Citadel
WCU
VMI
W&M

SoCon West
Samford
Mercer
UTC
ETSU
North Alabama
Tenn Tech

[FUBeAR]

Don’t hate it

Let’s do W&M AND Richmond in the East, move WCU to the west (some rivalry there with ETSU & UTC), and let N. Alabama stay where they are…wherever that be.

[Affirm]

Don’t hate it

Let’s do W&M AND Richmond in the East, move WCU to the west (some rivalry there with ETSU & UTC), and let N. Alabama stay where they are…wherever that be.

Yes to the above, but keep UNC-G.
EAST: UNC-G stays; and also add CoC, UNC-W.
WEST: Add Belmont, UNC-A, Lipscomb.

[FUBeAR]

Don’t hate it

Let’s do W&M AND Richmond in the East, move WCU to the west (some rivalry there with ETSU & UTC), and let N. Alabama stay where they are…wherever that be.

Yes to the above, but keep UNC-G.
EAST: UNC-G stays; and also add CoC, UNC-W.
WEST: Add Belmont, UNC-A, Lipscomb.

[FUpaladin08]

Love the ideas but I don’t know why a CAA team would jump for the SoCon. What’s the benefit, especially in football? The SoCon should look to expand in football to get the benefits the other large conferences get by not having the top teams pick each other off each year. I just think it has to come from the places jackel named, and those have to be a bus ride distance from the furthest SoCon school. So UNA and TN Tech make a ton of sense. I even wonder if Valdosta St would want to make the jump?

Ultimately the SoCon is becoming a basketball conference, if it isn’t already. Any moves on the football side have to make sense for basketball too. I think thats the holdup and they might just stay put, maybe too long, and have to settle.

[AstroDin]

Here's the rub… the last thing I think Furman and Wofford want is another school that institutional can bring in a year-to-year crop of transfers. We don't even know what the checks and balances are for, say, Chatty or Western and all those transfers. Will they still be on the team after the season?

Samford has sold out, and I'm not sure about Mercer.

[FUBeAR]

Here's the rub… the last thing I think Furman and Wofford want is another school that institutional can bring in a year-to-year crop of transfers. We don't even know what the checks and balances are for, say, Chatty or Western and all those transfers. Will they still be on the team after the season?

Samford has sold out, and I'm not sure about Mercer.

What does “sold out” mean in this context?

Chatt has always taken a fairly high number of transfers. They usually do seem to be more than the 1 year types and seem to integrate and become ‘real Mocs.’ Of course, they’ve increased their number of Grad Transfers since Covid and this past off-season was probably their highest number since FUBeAR has been seriously roster-watchin’ for the past 10 years or so.

WCU will be interesting. They took a bunch of transfers before Bell’s 1st year and a new bunch of them, along with a slew of Freshmen this year - over 60% roster turnover from Year 1 to Year 2 to … and FUBeAR would guess 85%+ since Bell arrived. Will be interesting to see their churn / retention this off-season.

Samford has always taken a higher number than one might expect, but they do tend to be the longer term types also. This year was different. They went CRAZY in the Portal. Will be interesting to see how that evolves this off-season - which will be impacted, of course, if they have a Coaching change.

[Affirm]

Don’t hate it

Let’s do W&M AND Richmond in the East, move WCU to the west (some rivalry there with ETSU & UTC), and let N. Alabama stay where they are…wherever that be.

Yes to the above, but keep UNC-G.
EAST: UNC-G stays; and also add CoC, UNC-W.
WEST: Add Belmont, UNC-A, Lipscomb.

Well .. what WILL you do when I bring up my other favorites.
Bring back Elon, add NCA&TSU, add High Point, add Winthrop, add Radford.
Basketball conference but at least I include 2 there who have football.

[Affirm]

Here's the rub… the last thing I think Furman and Wofford want is another school that institutional can bring in a year-to-year crop of transfers. We don't even know what the checks and balances are for, say, Chatty or Western and all those transfers. Will they still be on the team after the season?

Samford has sold out, and I'm not sure about Mercer.

What does “sold out” mean in this context?

I guess means “takes transfers often”.
Or perhaps it means “does whatever it takes to help football, with minimum possible regard for academics”.
Not sure, but those may be what “sold out” means, in context of what has been written above.

[FUBeAR]

Don’t hate it

Let’s do W&M AND Richmond in the East, move WCU to the west (some rivalry there with ETSU & UTC), and let N. Alabama stay where they are…wherever that be.

Yes to the above, but keep UNC-G.
EAST: UNC-G stays; and also add CoC, UNC-W.
WEST: Add Belmont, UNC-A, Lipscomb.

Well .. what WILL you do when I bring up my other favorites.
Bring back Elon, add NCA&TSU, add High Point, add Winthrop, add Radford.
Basketball conference but at least I include 2 there who have football.

[Affirm]

Don’t hate it

Let’s do W&M AND Richmond in the East, move WCU to the west (some rivalry there with ETSU & UTC), and let N. Alabama stay where they are…wherever that be.

Yes to the above, but keep UNC-G.
EAST: UNC-G stays; and also add CoC, UNC-W.
WEST: Add Belmont, UNC-A, Lipscomb.

Well .. what WILL you do when I bring up my other favorites.
Bring back Elon, add NCA&TSU, add High Point, add Winthrop, add Radford.
Basketball conference but at least I include 2 there who have football.

Got it.
Don’t do that, please.

[gman84]

Every coach has a different philosophy on how to build a program. Bell appears to be going the transfer route initially and he has made WCU relevant again. I'm curious how this sits with high school coaches and their ability to help their seniors. One thing for sure in 2022 is the paper these kids sign on signing days is more about their eligibility than who they commit to.

[AstroDin]

Sold out… is my take on it.
FuBear, you know admin-wise the hoops Furtman's athletic staffs go through in recruiting.
I don't see Furman as an institution adding 11-15 players yearly with eligibility ranging from a year to three years.
Samford, to me, is a head-scratcher. But probably an act of desperation by Hatcher. Clay has said as much - he said Furman would not be a rent-a-player for a-year program.

To your point, this is the norm for Chatty… my point is, why would a school like Furman and Wofford want to be at a further disadvantage competing against schools that reload year to year with football players with spotty academic accountability.

I look at Mercer differently (they have many Grad opportunities for legit transfers).

The real loser in all this is Wofford, not that I care.

[FUBeAR]

Sold out… is my take on it.
FuBear, you know admin-wise the hoops Furtman's athletic staffs go through in recruiting.
I don't see Furman as an institution adding 11-15 players yearly with eligibility ranging from a year to three years.
Samford, to me, is a head-scratcher. But probably an act of desperation by Hatcher. Clay has said as much - he said Furman would not be a rent-a-player for a-year program.

To your point, this is the norm for Chatty… my point is, why would a school like Furman and Wofford want to be at a further disadvantage competing against schools that reload year to year with football players with spotty academic accountability.

I look at Mercer differently (they have many Grad opportunities for legit transfers).

The real loser in all this is Wofford, not that I care.

Yeah - it can all get pretty nuanced, which is why FUBeAR doesn’t really like to ‘engage’ from a ‘who is holier’ perspective around this topic.

Each school has unique mission, requirements, opportunities, etc. Mercer, for example, strives to be exclusive academically, but also takes on the responsibility of changing lives / generations with intentional recruitment of 1st generation college students from rural and underrepresented communities in middle and South Georgia. Some of those might even be athletes with less than stellar academic records, but high potential…Is that ‘wrong?’ It absolutely falls within the mission of Mercer University, but ‘we’ may not like it…because FU couldn’t get that kid in school.

So…again…don’t love the topic from a “My Dad can beat up your Dad” perspective…and, TBH, it’s outta FUBeAR’s depth.

And…as the Top Atty for this Presidential Administration’s US Dept. of Labor has ruled they aren’t STUDENT Athletes anyway. Nope, they are now Employee Athletes…so….

[Furmanoid]

Sold out… is my take on it.
FuBear, you know admin-wise the hoops Furtman's athletic staffs go through in recruiting.
I don't see Furman as an institution adding 11-15 players yearly with eligibility ranging from a year to three years.
Samford, to me, is a head-scratcher. But probably an act of desperation by Hatcher. Clay has said as much - he said Furman would not be a rent-a-player for a-year program.

To your point, this is the norm for Chatty… my point is, why would a school like Furman and Wofford want to be at a further disadvantage competing against schools that reload year to year with football players with spotty academic accountability.

I look at Mercer differently (they have many Grad opportunities for legit transfers).

The real loser in all this is Wofford, not that I care.

HS coach tells me Wofford has gotten over all that academic requirement stuff. They’re no different from the rest except they don’t have many graduate programs.

I’ve been on here asking about FU’s requirements for about 10 years, and I’ve never got an answer. It is more strict for athletes than non athletes (which is incredibly stupid) but nobody seems to know how strict.

Is it really a huge advantage to have a team of one and dones? You’d need really simple offensive and defensive schemes that could be learned in just a few weeks, and you would never have any cohesion or “chemistry”. It would work now and then with the right group but it would be really iffy. Plus you bring in a new guy to take the job from the guy who’s been with you. You could quickly develop 2 teams who hate each other.

I’d love to see us get very targeted transfers, linemen mostly. Then let’s watch and see how depending heavily on transfers works out at other teams. Remember, transfers all failed. That’s why they transferred. (Except grad students)