Grainger Leaving

[AstroDin]

My last addition to this subject - I think rightly so the Furman staff felt confident in what they have/had at QB.
I also doubt they wanted Grainger to leave, there is a lot we don't know here and we won't know (was it fit, academics, what?).

CCH had several publically stated goals for recruiting. Adding playmakers and athleticism along the d-line and o-line as well as build depth.

This is a balancing act that I have no idea how you weigh these decisions when building a program. Furman comes into the 2021 season with not just depth at running back but with a stable of six talented running backs.

[The Jackal]

I had also forgotten that we had a commit from Texas, Carter Bir, in the 2019 class that opted to walk on at TCU. I think he had even committed, signed, and then transferred.

Again, I'm not sure what else our coaching staff is supposed to do on this kind of stuff. I call it bad luck. You can call it whatever you want.

You’re making a pretty good argument for what I was trying to say. Getting really good QB’s is HARD. It isn’t that it’s bad luck when you lose out. It’s fantastic luck when you get one. And you have to have that luck once a year. If you get 2 in one year, you have to expect one to transfer. But you always need 3 on hand who can run your offense well when (not if) the injuries come.

You are right, fcs has to look for that overlooked guy. Either he’s got the arm but he’s too small (injury risk and needs a short o line) or he doesn’t pass much in his team’s system (even though he wins and runs his offense to perfection). That second kind of guy is out there in large numbers. He can be an ok college passer and a good overall QB.

It just seems wiser to get multiple ok athletic qb’s and use a system that suits their abilities. The key is always going to be the OL. The smart slightly undersized guys with quick feet that your strength coach can build into monsters. If you can impose your will running you are going to start seeing wide open receivers, which takes the pressure off the qb. But so far our line just isn’t quite there. Nobody’s saying don’t pass. Just don’t use an offense that depends too much on a guy you may not have no matter how much effort you put into qb recruiting. Our coaches know that. If our OL improves a little bit we’ll be undefeated.

I would agree here. You probably want 2 things in QBs. 1) 3 of them -so I agree we were one guy short...
But here is the real big key 2) you want them in DIFFERENT YEARS/CLASSES - I was always wondering with Hamp and Grainger if one (either) would maybe leave.

It is Very odd to have only two QBs COMBINED with both being the same class. You almost know in this day and age (right or wrong) of the transfer portal that one of those guys is a high chance to leave. So with that said, I think we should have offered maybe two last year. Then if the guy goes to TCU (as he did) you still have one. I also agree that recruiting is part art and part science. I get that you never know who you will get. I do. However, when my two top QBs are the .. very .. same .. class - it would honestly take luck for one Not to transfer.

And I know that this is hindsight. I get that. But I think it is a reasonable point to note it is strange to have your best two QBs in the same class . I have to assume they (Sisson/Grainger) were the best two and that is why the coaches took Shiflett and put him at WR.

This really isn't anything new for Furman.

If we go back through our list of QBs, I think you'll find that really the last time we had a run of a two year starter at QB handing off the reigns to his backup, who then started two years was probably the late 90s through Napier's final season in 2003.

Since that time, we've started a bunch of 5th year seniors, freshmen, walk-ons and transfers. That has been the case through now three different coaching staffs - guys either seeing the field too early or too late to truly build depth at the position.

Again, it's a fickle position. Rarely do you see QBs contribute on special teams or rotate into the game. Only one plays, unlike other positions. QBs are often the most talented athletes on their high school teams and I'm sure are looking for opportunities to come in and contribute immediately. We've just had a hard time getting back to consistency.

[youwouldno]

Hendrix is hired in December 2016. He immediately tries to add a QB in the 2017 class. The original target, Jalen Greene, flips his commitment to Elon late in the game. Furman fills that spot with JeMar Lincoln.

Signing recruits is not a matter of "luck." It's one of the core responsibilities of a college coaching staff. When a staff targets the wrong players, that's not "bad luck." Jalen Greene turned out to not even be a good QB, and Lincoln of course was ineffective and then transferred to be a walk-on basketball player. That's bad recruiting, not bad luck.

Lincoln, of course, leaves the program before the season. So, now back to three scholarship QBs - a redshirt senior that had never started and two true freshmen.

Lincoln leaving was not "bad luck" since it was apparent he wasn't the answer at the QB position. That was just a consequence of a recruiting error.

Having just taken two QBs in 2018, Furman did not take a QB in the 2019 class. As best I could tell from following reported offers, Furman was not even in the market for a QB in that class given that most of the snaps were going to go to two freshmen.

Well not taking a QB in that class was an obvious mistake that the team might pay for in the near future. The fact they had a commit (maybe not full scholarship?) back out is again not "bad luck," it means the staff did not identify the right fit for the program.

So, Furman heads into 2020 with two redshirt sophomore QBs. They have a commitment from Wilson for the 2021 class.

Now we find out Grainger is transferring. In his public comments, Grainger indicated that his decision to transfer wasn't anything Furman did. Maybe he stays, maybe he goes. Maybe he lost out to Sisson. I don't know, but it doesn't seem like the situation was "mishandled" by Furman. At least not according to Grainger.

Just because the staff didn't "mishandle" the situation doesn't make it "bad luck." QBs that lose starting competitions transfer all the time. That's not "bad luck," that's just the nature of college football. That's a big reason why depth is important in the first place.

So, what could have been done different?

(1) Sign and enroll a quality QB in the 2019 class
(2) Sign a better fit/lower-risk prospect in the 2017 class

Had those things been done differently, the Paladins would almost certainly have at least 2 scholarship QBs on the roster, and potentially 3, even without a transfer.

[The Jackal]

That's just 20/20 hindsight, though.

Jemar Lincoln looks like a bad sign in 2017 if you knew he was going to leave football. They didn't know that, though. He was in the running to start in 2018.

Kids change their mind. Happens all the time to every program. The hard part is that most programs don't carry an army of QBs.

[Sir William]

That's just 20/20 hindsight, though.

Jemar Lincoln looks like a bad sign in 2017 if you knew he was going to leave football. They didn't know that, though. He was in the running to start in 2018.

Kids change their mind. Happens all the time to every program. The hard part is that most programs don't carry an army of QBs.

Not only that, but if you recall (and youwouldno would not remember this, not being a part of the Furman family), Hendrix was not hired as HC until very late in the recruiting season in 2017. The fact that he took a Furman program from the pit of mediocrity to a 7-4 record and FCS playoff appearance (and first round win) in his first season, speaks volumes about his ability to lead and coach. The way he has steadily built the program back up and is the current SoCon favorite speaks volumes of his and his staff’s ability to recruit and coach.

Hate to see Grainger go, but we’ll be just fine. Lot of confidence in Sisson and in this coaching staff and team.

[youwouldno]

That's just 20/20 hindsight, though.

Jemar Lincoln looks like a bad sign in 2017 if you knew he was going to leave football. They didn't know that, though. He was in the running to start in 2018.

Kids change their mind. Happens all the time to every program. The hard part is that most programs don't carry an army of QBs.

Not only that, but if you recall (and youwouldno would not remember this, not being a part of the Furman family), Hendrix was not hired as HC until very late in the recruiting season in 2017. The fact that he took a Furman program from the pit of mediocrity to a 7-4 record and FCS playoff appearance (and first round win) in his first season, speaks volumes about his ability to lead and coach. The way he has steadily built the program back up and is the current SoCon favorite speaks volumes of his and his staff’s ability to recruit and coach.

Hate to see Grainger go, but we’ll be just fine. Lot of confidence in Sisson and in this coaching staff and team.

Not sure why I wouldn't remember that, hiring coaches is public knowledge, it wasn't done through a secret ceremony.

I've always said Hendrix is a very good coach. No one is infallible. The QB situation could be better, that's just a fact.

[FUBeAR]

That's just 20/20 hindsight

It’s a very rare occasion when Jackal & FUBeAR agree on anything, but these were the exact words that crossed my mind as I was reading youwouldno’s post.

Also - we don’t know that Jalen Green wouldn’t have been an FCS All-American QB if he had come to FU instead of elsewhere. Different Coaching, different Offense, different environment...you never know.

And, I think there’s a lot more to the whole Lincoln situation. And, if I’m not mistaken, I believe the ‘ineffective’ Mr. Lincoln led us to our most recent victory over the bellhops...

FUR - Passing
Player Cmp Att. Yds. TD INT Long Sack
JeMar Lincoln 9 12 140 0 0 44

FUR - Rushing
Player Att. Gain Loss Net TD Lg. Avg.
JeMar Lincoln 17 55 24 31 3 17

Not a bad day at the office...and that was pretty much his farewell party as well...yeah...more to that story, I believe.

All College Teams have QB problems these days...pretty much.
All HS Teams have QB problems AND QB Parents problems these days.

The next time FUBeAR designs an Offense, it will be QB-Free. Get all Kicking & QB’s out of this game, and we’d sure have us somethin’!!!

[Paul C]

Chase Brice (Clemson, Duke) is in the transfer portal again. Two yrs of eligibility left. Just FYI

[Furmanoid]

Afraid the lack of graduate programs probably knocks us out of the running.

[FurmAlum]

I admire Coach Hendrix for recruiting, developing, and sticking with players like Sisson and Grainger. Bringing in a transfer now would be a slap in the face to Sisson who has worked his ass off for almost 3 years.

He is finally ready and we have him for 3 more seasons. I am confidant that he will shine at QB and lead the team to many future victories.

[The Jackal]

I admire Coach Hendrix for recruiting, developing, and sticking with players like Sisson and Grainger. Bringing in a transfer now would be a slap in the face to Sisson who has worked his ass off for almost 3 years.

He is finally ready and we have him for 3 more seasons. I am confidant that he will shine at QB and lead the team to many future victories.

That is one of the major downsides to taking transfers. You sort of throw cold water on those guys that committed to the program and worked their way into playing time.

Perhaps an unintended consequence (especially this year) is the mass use by the transfer portal. If everyone is transferring, is no one transferring?

[Furmanoid]

I admire Coach Hendrix for recruiting, developing, and sticking with players like Sisson and Grainger. Bringing in a transfer now would be a slap in the face to Sisson who has worked his ass off for almost 3 years.

He is finally ready and we have him for 3 more seasons. I am confidant that he will shine at QB and lead the team to many future victories.

He seems to be kind of brilliant, so wouldn’t he transfer somewhere with a really good grad program for ‘22?

[FUPlayer74]

In my opinion, 99.9% of the time, players transfer because they ain't getting playing time or think they ain't gonna get playing time.

[Furmanoid]

I was just thinking that if you were a smart kid with a career path, once you graduated you would probably move on to Law School, MBA, etc rather than hanging around FU just to play football, especially if you can play at the new school.

[FUBeAR]

I was just thinking that if you were a smart kid with a career path, once you graduated you would probably move on to Law School, MBA, etc rather than hanging around FU just to play football, especially if you can play at the new school.

Back in the day, some 5th year Football Players were able to enroll in the joint Clemson - Furman MBA Program. Didn’t Harris Roberts do something similar with the 3-2 (or whatever they call it these days) Clemson / Furman Engineering program.

Not an Academian...but I would bet a creative Administration could form similar alliances/programs with a broad array of online Schools, so that 5th year Athletes could start their Graduate School & be eligible to play at FU their 5th year.

BTW - don’t dis “Online Schools” - FUBeAR Jr. Is currently getting his MS in Computer Engineering in an all Online Program. Fairly well-respected Eng. School is sponsoring that - Georgia Tech. That online degree is gonna be just as valuable as their non online one...particularly these days when every school (almost) is online.