$10 Homecoming tickets
By all means lets start bulldozing the stadium to make it look fuller
apaladin, Davemeister liked this
Right - I mean we say "i am sure Furman is exploring this.." I am not so sure. "Trust, - but verify! "paladinduece wrote: ↑Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:34 pm
I think of the environment a recruit sees as well. Empty stands don't equate to helping that.
I thought Fowler would have run good OL blocking schemes - I tried to trust. That got me burnt. We had 5 or 6 OL where the scheme couldn't stop 3 DL - THREE !
More to the point, the time I was really SHOCKED was when I was told by many that the fund was now set up to allow more pay for CH. I was told that numerous times (probably 7 PMs). I called to verify and was told in no uncertain terms that that is the ONE thing (pay for CH) the fund can NOT do ! Since CH is in charge of the funding the one thing it cannot be used for is to change his salary.. (conflict of interest). He can use it to change his assistants salaries but not his. There was an entire thread on how the fund was set up for the very purpose of paying CH more. That turned out to be untrue. NEVER assume anything - I learned this a long time ago in business and the more I call and check details the more I am stunned at how we cannot assume anything.. anything (not just Furman.. I mean anywhere)
That said, I wonder if they are exploring these options? It seems these would be easy options as some (RA day) have been done in the past. I like the 'have the players go to schools in the area and hand out tickets'. Some of these ideas would absolutely get 500 more people here in total and that makes a difference
THIS. give away tickets.. . get 500-1000 more people here.. Recruits love to see atmosphere. As I said, my friend's son is down to us and Mercer and he likes our strength coach.. liked their atmosphere better/ those are his two main decision points as both are good schools
gofurman wrote: ↑Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:20 pmRight - I mean we say "i am sure Furman is exploring this.." I am not so sure. "Trust, - but verify! "paladinduece wrote: ↑Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:34 pm
I think of the environment a recruit sees as well. Empty stands don't equate to helping that.
I thought Fowler would have run good OL blocking schemes - I tried to trust. That got me burnt. We had 5 or 6 OL where the scheme couldn't stop 3 DL - THREE !
More to the point, the time I was really SHOCKED was when I was told by many that the fund was now set up to allow more pay for CH. I was told that numerous times (probably 7 PMs). I called to verify and was told in no uncertain terms that that is the ONE thing (pay for CH) the fund can NOT do ! Since CH is in charge of the funding the one thing it cannot be used for is to change his salary.. (conflict of interest). He can use it to change his assistants salaries but not his. There was an entire thread on how the fund was set up for the very purpose of paying CH more. That turned out to be untrue. NEVER assume anything - I learned this a long time ago in business and the more I call and check details the more I am stunned at how we cannot assume anything.. anything (not just Furman.. I mean anywhere)
That said, I wonder if they are exploring these options? It seems these would be easy options as some (RA day) have been done in the past. I like the 'have the players go to schools in the area and hand out tickets'. Some of these ideas would absolutely get 500 more people here in total and that makes a difference
Yep, I think when Furman does start putting forth the full force effort it will be easy for us to notice
As I have said, we are getting by with the minimum right now, 5,000 folks at ETSU game for a Top 15 Furman team is the bare minimum, season ticket holders, player parents, a few students and a few visiting fans, those are all people who would be there no matter what, we need to add a TON more layers to that to start growing this fan base again
Our team is atop the SoCon again as defending champs and rolling again this year, ranked #11 in the polls and climbing, even taking the likes of Virginia Tech to the wire, feels like the program has arrived once again
I want to see Furman and everyone for that matter do more to draw fans back to Paladin Stadium, whatever it takes, lets get it done!
Whew, off weeks.
I think we need to put a lot of this in context.
Furman Football has a long history of seriously outpunching its weight, both on the field and in the stands. I'd argue that we're still doing both, but there are realities and trends that there's only so much Furman can do to fight.
Rather than trying to compare our current attendance to "the glory days" (and our memory of attendance there is probably a little inflated), look at Furman compared to the rest of FCS football. Even strong programs. Things have changed, everywhere.
Furman has about 2,600 students and is averaging 6,000 in attendance per game. Which seems bad compared to 20 years ago, when I'd say it was about 9,000-10,000 per SoCon game (reported numbers were definitely inflated back then). But we're still drawing more than double Furman's small enrollment.
Let's take a look at some other FCS teams.
Weber State - #4 team in the country. Enrollment - 26,000+
A couple of weeks ago, they hosted Top 10 Northern Iowa. Huge game.
Attendance: 6500
Villanova - #5, undefeated. Enrollment - 10,000+
One of the highest profile athletic programs in the FCS.
Their reported attendance is in the 5000-7000 range, peaking at 10,000 with a big game against Maine recently, as their momentum builds with an undefeated record.
Northern Iowa - Top 10 FCS team for many years now. Play in the famous (infamous?) UNI dome, which seats 16,000, like Paladin Stadium. Enrollmment - 10,000+
Average attendance - around 8500
Towson - perrenial top 25 teams in recent years (currently #9), 22,000 students, average attendance - 8,000
I could go on and on.
Then you've got the exceptions - North Dakota State, Montana, James Madison - massive schools with huge budgets, national championships (plural) and that rare handle on their local community that's so hard to come by in FCS. Those teams are able to stretch up just a little bit to the 15,000-20,000 range.
But the rest of the story in FCS is pretty dour from an attendance point of view. And all of those schools (except PC and Wofford) are larger than Furman - most are significantly larger.
So, I would argue that Furman is still doing an alright job as far as attendance. But things have changed. There are a ton more FCS schools in the region than there used to be. College Football media has blown up and put all of that attention on Power 5 FBS schools, so the perception of FCS football has suffered greatly. And with each passing generation, interest in football has gone down (which is not a good or bad thing, interest in football is not some moral imperative).
The average Furman student has little interest in football and has every minute of every day spoken for. My wife works at Furman, and I've gotten to know a lot of students. I can't express how stressed and crunched these kids are. So much worse than when I was there just a decade ago. So when Furman students don't take 3 hours out of their Saturday to sit in a boiling hot stadium to watch a team they've been given little reason to care about - I really can't say I blame them.
Promotions can help some. The athletic department has to do everything it can. The stadium is too big, but it's always been too big.
The only thing that will move the needle is prolonged excellence (something Furman hasn't had since 2006). It looks like we may be approaching that. But even if we become a perennial Top 10 team again, 16,000 people aren't going to show up every week. We can maybe get back in the 9,000-10,000 range, which I would again argue is amazing for a lower division school as tiny as Furman is.
So keep showing up. Invite friends. That's about all you can do.
But getting snarky and angry about Furman employees or students or whatever isn't going to do anything except spread negativity.
I think we need to put a lot of this in context.
Furman Football has a long history of seriously outpunching its weight, both on the field and in the stands. I'd argue that we're still doing both, but there are realities and trends that there's only so much Furman can do to fight.
Rather than trying to compare our current attendance to "the glory days" (and our memory of attendance there is probably a little inflated), look at Furman compared to the rest of FCS football. Even strong programs. Things have changed, everywhere.
Furman has about 2,600 students and is averaging 6,000 in attendance per game. Which seems bad compared to 20 years ago, when I'd say it was about 9,000-10,000 per SoCon game (reported numbers were definitely inflated back then). But we're still drawing more than double Furman's small enrollment.
Let's take a look at some other FCS teams.
Weber State - #4 team in the country. Enrollment - 26,000+
A couple of weeks ago, they hosted Top 10 Northern Iowa. Huge game.
Attendance: 6500
Villanova - #5, undefeated. Enrollment - 10,000+
One of the highest profile athletic programs in the FCS.
Their reported attendance is in the 5000-7000 range, peaking at 10,000 with a big game against Maine recently, as their momentum builds with an undefeated record.
Northern Iowa - Top 10 FCS team for many years now. Play in the famous (infamous?) UNI dome, which seats 16,000, like Paladin Stadium. Enrollmment - 10,000+
Average attendance - around 8500
Towson - perrenial top 25 teams in recent years (currently #9), 22,000 students, average attendance - 8,000
I could go on and on.
Then you've got the exceptions - North Dakota State, Montana, James Madison - massive schools with huge budgets, national championships (plural) and that rare handle on their local community that's so hard to come by in FCS. Those teams are able to stretch up just a little bit to the 15,000-20,000 range.
But the rest of the story in FCS is pretty dour from an attendance point of view. And all of those schools (except PC and Wofford) are larger than Furman - most are significantly larger.
So, I would argue that Furman is still doing an alright job as far as attendance. But things have changed. There are a ton more FCS schools in the region than there used to be. College Football media has blown up and put all of that attention on Power 5 FBS schools, so the perception of FCS football has suffered greatly. And with each passing generation, interest in football has gone down (which is not a good or bad thing, interest in football is not some moral imperative).
The average Furman student has little interest in football and has every minute of every day spoken for. My wife works at Furman, and I've gotten to know a lot of students. I can't express how stressed and crunched these kids are. So much worse than when I was there just a decade ago. So when Furman students don't take 3 hours out of their Saturday to sit in a boiling hot stadium to watch a team they've been given little reason to care about - I really can't say I blame them.
Promotions can help some. The athletic department has to do everything it can. The stadium is too big, but it's always been too big.
The only thing that will move the needle is prolonged excellence (something Furman hasn't had since 2006). It looks like we may be approaching that. But even if we become a perennial Top 10 team again, 16,000 people aren't going to show up every week. We can maybe get back in the 9,000-10,000 range, which I would again argue is amazing for a lower division school as tiny as Furman is.
So keep showing up. Invite friends. That's about all you can do.
But getting snarky and angry about Furman employees or students or whatever isn't going to do anything except spread negativity.
This is dead on and I appreciate the context relative to the other FCS schools. If the team stays in the polls the Greenville community will take notice again. The more people see that ranked number next to Furman’s name on a news segment or in the paper the better. Look what it did for basketball in such a short time. Perennial playoff contender helps too as those games are usually happening during the most pointless of FBS bowl games. Home playoff games being even more important.BackupQB wrote: ↑Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:01 amThe only thing that will move the needle is prolonged excellence (something Furman hasn't had since 2006). It looks like we may be approaching that. But even if we become a perennial Top 10 team again, 16,000 people aren't going to show up every week. We can maybe get back in the 9,000-10,000 range, which I would again argue is amazing for a lower division school as tiny as Furman is.
So keep showing up. Invite friends. That's about all you can do.
But getting snarky and angry about Furman employees or students or whatever isn't going to do anything except spread negativity.
Great Post by Backup QB! As far as the students feeling stressed, I guess times have changed. As a former FU athlete and reasonably decent student, I never felt stressed at Furman (except around exam time).
I've never been to Mercer, but I think the atmosphere at the football games is great. We visited every year on family weekend when my daughter was at FU and still come to games when we can drive 400 miles for a weekend. I love walking down the mall and seeing all those tents sponsored by the various clubs/fraternities, etc. I few more fans would help, but it is still good.
I've never been to Mercer, but I think the atmosphere at the football games is great. We visited every year on family weekend when my daughter was at FU and still come to games when we can drive 400 miles for a weekend. I love walking down the mall and seeing all those tents sponsored by the various clubs/fraternities, etc. I few more fans would help, but it is still good.
Affirm liked this
Mercer did a fantastic job getting their program going and rallying fan support. But things are deteriorating quickly in that department as the "winning" part stalls.FurmAlum wrote: ↑Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:29 pmGreat Post by Backup QB! As far as the students feeling stressed, I guess times have changed. As a former FU athlete and reasonably decent student, I never felt stressed at Furman (except around exam time).
I've never been to Mercer, but I think the atmosphere at the football games is great. We visited every year on family weekend when my daughter was at FU and still come to games when we can drive 400 miles for a weekend. I love walking down the mall and seeing all those tents sponsored by the various clubs/fraternities, etc. I few more fans would help, but it is still good.
Despite reporting attendance of over 8,000 this past weekend against Chattanooga (which would be 80% stadium capacity), it looked maybe 20-25% full on TV. A Mercer fan at the game on the AGS board (not sure if it was FUBear or not) said the same.
Also, I’m not sure the city of Mercer has the selection of various things to do on any given Saturday as Greenville does.
BackupQB wrote: ↑Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:01 amWhew, off weeks.
I think we need to put a lot of this in context.
Furman Football has a long history of seriously outpunching its weight, both on the field and in the stands. I'd argue that we're still doing both, but there are realities and trends that there's only so much Furman can do to fight.
Rather than trying to compare our current attendance to "the glory days" (and our memory of attendance there is probably a little inflated), look at Furman compared to the rest of FCS football. Even strong programs. Things have changed, everywhere.
Furman has about 2,600 students and is averaging 6,000 in attendance per game. Which seems bad compared to 20 years ago, when I'd say it was about 9,000-10,000 per SoCon game (reported numbers were definitely inflated back then). But we're still drawing more than double Furman's small enrollment.
Let's take a look at some other FCS teams.
Weber State - #4 team in the country. Enrollment - 26,000+
A couple of weeks ago, they hosted Top 10 Northern Iowa. Huge game.
Attendance: 6500
Villanova - #5, undefeated. Enrollment - 10,000+
One of the highest profile athletic programs in the FCS.
Their reported attendance is in the 5000-7000 range, peaking at 10,000 with a big game against Maine recently, as their momentum builds with an undefeated record.
Northern Iowa - Top 10 FCS team for many years now. Play in the famous (infamous?) UNI dome, which seats 16,000, like Paladin Stadium. Enrollmment - 10,000+
Average attendance - around 8500
Towson - perrenial top 25 teams in recent years (currently #9), 22,000 students, average attendance - 8,000
I could go on and on.
Then you've got the exceptions - North Dakota State, Montana, James Madison - massive schools with huge budgets, national championships (plural) and that rare handle on their local community that's so hard to come by in FCS. Those teams are able to stretch up just a little bit to the 15,000-20,000 range.
But the rest of the story in FCS is pretty dour from an attendance point of view. And all of those schools (except PC and Wofford) are larger than Furman - most are significantly larger.
So, I would argue that Furman is still doing an alright job as far as attendance. But things have changed. There are a ton more FCS schools in the region than there used to be. College Football media has blown up and put all of that attention on Power 5 FBS schools, so the perception of FCS football has suffered greatly. And with each passing generation, interest in football has gone down (which is not a good or bad thing, interest in football is not some moral imperative).
The average Furman student has little interest in football and has every minute of every day spoken for. My wife works at Furman, and I've gotten to know a lot of students. I can't express how stressed and crunched these kids are. So much worse than when I was there just a decade ago. So when Furman students don't take 3 hours out of their Saturday to sit in a boiling hot stadium to watch a team they've been given little reason to care about - I really can't say I blame them.
Promotions can help some. The athletic department has to do everything it can. The stadium is too big, but it's always been too big.
The only thing that will move the needle is prolonged excellence (something Furman hasn't had since 2006). It looks like we may be approaching that. But even if we become a perennial Top 10 team again, 16,000 people aren't going to show up every week. We can maybe get back in the 9,000-10,000 range, which I would again argue is amazing for a lower division school as tiny as Furman is.
So keep showing up. Invite friends. That's about all you can do.
But getting snarky and angry about Furman employees or students or whatever isn't going to do anything except spread negativity.
Excuses are great but they don't move the needle
Ill be happy when I see Furman start putting forth more effort and doing more well-thought-out promotions
agree to an extent - one thing the school CAN DO for sure !!! is to bid to host a playoff game. That hasn't been mentioned much here as I know we are focused on reg season attendance (and that matters more I agree) . But a home playoff game - which absolutely is a process Furman CAN control - helps attendance AND helps win the games since they are at home which then helps attendance as we win more ! We haven't bid to host a playoff since I can't recall when ..2005 and 04 and 01 I think we were seeded? ... I know in 2017 Elon outbid us.. 2013 we were outbid by SC State who LITERALLY can't keep the lights on they are in such dire fiscal straits! 2006 Montana st outbid us.. I keep looking through the interwebs - apparently in 02 we played Villanova in Philly so not then either...FUpaladin08 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:21 amThis is dead on and I appreciate the context relative to the other FCS schools. If the team stays in the polls the Greenville community will take notice again. The more people see that ranked number next to Furman’s name on a news segment or in the paper the better. Look what it did for basketball in such a short time. Perennial playoff contender helps too as those games are usually happening during the most pointless of FBS bowl games. Home playoff games being even more important.BackupQB wrote: ↑Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:01 amThe only thing that will move the needle is prolonged excellence (something Furman hasn't had since 2006). It looks like we may be approaching that. But even if we become a perennial Top 10 team again, 16,000 people aren't going to show up every week. We can maybe get back in the 9,000-10,000 range, which I would again argue is amazing for a lower division school as tiny as Furman is.
So keep showing up. Invite friends. That's about all you can do.
But getting snarky and angry about Furman employees or students or whatever isn't going to do anything except spread negativity.
EDIT - I just found the answer... we have NEVER placed a winning bid to get a home playoff game.
We hosted in 99 and 2000 vs Umass and Hofstra but those were in years of 16 teams in playoffs. Thus every team was seeded .. top 8 had home field. SInce the expansion to 24 teams and thus BIDs we have been outbid all 4 times. THAT is something the school COULD fix !2017 Elon outbid us..
2013 we were outbid by SC State
2006 Montana st outbid us..
02 we played Villanova in Philly (looks to be a BID year also)
Pretty sure we got outbid by Richmond in the second round 2005 Playoffs as well, that's why we had to play that game on the road I think
But maybe we outbid Nicholls State to have a home game in the first round, they only seeded 4 teams that year
But maybe we outbid Nicholls State to have a home game in the first round, they only seeded 4 teams that year
Dungeonrealm, good point as I wasn't really sure in those years as the process was changing. I did some more quick google work and It appears everything was a BID then except for 4 seeds. So yes, it appears we outbid Nicholls State in 2005 and then Richmond outbid us in round 2 as there was no seed leftDungeonRealm wrote: ↑Sun Oct 13, 2019 1:50 pmPretty sure we got outbid by Richmond in the second round 2005 Playoffs as well, that's why we had to play that game on the road I think
But maybe we outbid Nicholls State to have a home game in the first round, they only seeded 4 teams that year
(page down about 2/3 or more on page I linked and you see all playoff and host institutions: it is a good layout)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_NCAA ... all_season
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_NCAA ... all_season
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_NCAA ... all_season
2 other tidbits I had to look up while in there - it was 2010 the playoffs went to 20 teams.. and in 2013 (when we went) was the first year of 24 teams
Last edited by gofurman on Sun Oct 13, 2019 8:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
My guess is that Nicholls didn't even submit a bid, not sure if Furman really "outbid" them.