The Fallout

[Affirm]

It’s just a letdown that’s all and you are right that we should get over it. But it is hard to accept. I started following Furman when my brothers went there in the 70’s. At the time USC was a big deal nationally but little Furman overtook them under Joe Williams and was clearly the better program after a few years. Meanwhile Wofford was struggling in NAIA- not really competitive with Newberry (a powerhouse) or even Erskine. We had a few good Jonathan Moore years when I was at Furman, but we’ve been pretty crappy ever since. Meanwhile Wofford has caught up and passed us by. How could that happen? Last year I got all excited thinking we were on our way back but it looks like my expectations were too high. I shouldn’t expect to beat the Terriers.

You are right about why it stinks to be looking up to WC in FB & in MBB. I am from the era, late 60’s early 70’s, when they LITERALLY were not our league, nor our division of college sports (though they were competitive in NAIA football and had a national playoff game in our stadium). Over the last 25 years, they have surpassed us on multiple occasions in Men’s BB & FB. Yet we have people on this very board saying stuff like “I assure you that FU athletics is FAR better funded than WC athletics.” I can only conclude that we want to be better in all of our sports, not good exclusively in FB & MBB. If that’s it, I can accept that. If it’s something else, for example poor leadership and/or poor decisions-making and/or poor administration and/or lack of overall commitment by FU and its constituents including alumni, then I would have a major problem with FU trailing the Wofford dog’s rear end.

[CharlieFU]

It’s just a letdown that’s all and you are right that we should get over it. But it is hard to accept. I started following Furman when my brothers went there in the 70’s. At the time USC was a big deal nationally but little Furman overtook them under Joe Williams and was clearly the better program after a few years. Meanwhile Wofford was struggling in NAIA- not really competitive with Newberry (a powerhouse) or even Erskine. We had a few good Jonathan Moore years when I was at Furman, but we’ve been pretty crappy ever since. Meanwhile Wofford has caught up and passed us by. How could that happen? Last year I got all excited thinking we were on our way back but it looks like my expectations were too high. I shouldn’t expect to beat the Terriers.

Last 3 years in a row we have won 20+ games, and won 19 the year before that. And will win 20+ this year. Several post season appearances in last few years, including several post season home games. If that is not "on our way back," then I dont know what is!

It's a bigger picture than Wofford. Comparing us to them us to them is giving them too much credit. (Everybody seems to have already forgotten our win over ETSU.) Are we competitive again in the SoCon? Yes! Can we get better? Yes!

As my daddy (Class of 1941) used to say, "Good gosh, Miss Agnes!"

[cavedweller2]

Most teams with similar percentages have 100-200 fewer attempts. Only San Francisco (13-6) and UTSA (11-8) have similar attempts and percentages. So our approach is not typical. But you may be right that it is all we can do with the guys we have. Just saying we shouldn’t be surprised at our streakiness.

UTSA Road Runners. I have one of their t shirts.

[Davemeister]

For me, the most valid question about Furman MBB is: Can we win the SoCon Tournament this year?

[tim]

It’s just a letdown that’s all and you are right that we should get over it. But it is hard to accept. I started following Furman when my brothers went there in the 70’s. At the time USC was a big deal nationally but little Furman overtook them under Joe Williams and was clearly the better program after a few years. Meanwhile Wofford was struggling in NAIA- not really competitive with Newberry (a powerhouse) or even Erskine. We had a few good Jonathan Moore years when I was at Furman, but we’ve been pretty crappy ever since. Meanwhile Wofford has caught up and passed us by. How could that happen? Last year I got all excited thinking we were on our way back but it looks like my expectations were too high. I shouldn’t expect to beat the Terriers.

You are right about why it stinks to be looking up to WC in FB & in MBB. I am from the era, late 60’s early 70’s, when they LITERALLY were not our league, nor our division of college sports (though they were competitive in NAIA football and had a national playoff game in our stadium). Over the last 25 years, they have surpassed us on multiple occasions in Men’s BB & FB. Yet we have people on this very board saying stuff like “I assure you that FU athletics is FAR better funded than WC athletics.” I can only conclude that we want to be better in all of our sports, not good exclusively in FB & MBB. If that’s it, I can accept that. If it’s something else, for example poor leadership and/or poor decisions-making and/or poor administration and/or lack of overall commitment by FU and its constituents including alumni, then I would have a major problem with FU trailing the Wofford dog’s rear end.

A lot of the Woffy success has been the hiring and retention of Mike Ayers and Mike Young. An unusual thing for a school like Woffy(or Furman for that matter). Two very good coaches who stayed multiple years. When you think of McKillop at Davidson, Furman has been fighting that for a number of years. I doubt these coaches stayed for money, although I don't know that.

[apaladin]

For me, the most valid question about Furman MBB is: Can we win the SoCon Tournament this year?

Of course we all know the answer is no because the curse lives on. We have only come close a couple of times in 40 years. That is why we need to win as many as possible to possibly get an NIT at large bid.

[apaladin]

As much as I hate Wofford, and Lord I do, they may not be as bad as we think. Yes, they have been unimpressive up until the other night, but they still have 2 starters, and at least 4-5 players from last year's team that not only went undefeated in the SoCon, but also won the SoCon tournament, an NCAA tourney game, and almost beat UK.

That means they still know how to win and maybe they have struggled so far with a new coach and blending in new players. Nobody in the conference has beat them in Sburg yet. They're getting better and will be hard to beat the rest of the season.

We just need to get a little rest, practice, regroup, and come out swinging. The season is far from over.

The only reason FU lost the game Friday night was FU! We would not have beaten anyone in the SoCon Friday night.

[Furmanoid]

We can beat almost anybody. We can certainly beat anybody in the SoCon. But it will take above average 3 shooting in at least two consecutive games to win the tournament (unless the other guys choke which is always possible). It’s real simple. If we’re hot we win. If we aren’t we don’t. If we don’t expect to win the SoCon we might not belong in the NIT.

[apaladin]

We can beat almost anybody. We can certainly beat anybody in the SoCon. But it will take above average 3 shooting in at least two consecutive games to win the tournament (unless the other guys choke which is always possible). It’s real simple. If we’re hot we win. If we aren’t we don’t. If we don’t expect to win the SoCon we might not belong in the NIT.

More than likely FU will have to beat 3 of the following on 3 consecutive days: WCU, UTC, WC, ETSU, UNCG. That is a huge mountain to climb and there will be 2 teams(ETSU, UNCG) that will only have to win 2 from the above list plus FU. Huge advantage to finish 1 or 2 especially this year when the top 6 are pretty good.

[tim]

As much as I hate Wofford, and Lord I do, they may not be as bad as we think. Yes, they have been unimpressive up until the other night, but they still have 2 starters, and at least 4-5 players from last year's team that not only went undefeated in the SoCon, but also won the SoCon tournament, an NCAA tourney game, and almost beat UK.

That means they still know how to win and maybe they have struggled so far with a new coach and blending in new players. Nobody in the conference has beat them in Sburg yet. They're getting better and will be hard to beat the rest of the season.

We just need to get a little rest, practice, regroup, and come out swinging. The season is far from over.

The only reason FU lost the game Friday night was FU! We would not have beaten anyone in the SoCon Friday night.

THATS the thing that bothers me! I didn't recognize the Furman team that took the floor Friday night!

[Jasper]

For me, the most valid question about Furman MBB is: Can we win the SoCon Tournament this year?

Of course we all know the answer is no because the curse lives on. We have only come close a couple of times in 40 years. That is why we need to win as many as possible to possibly get an NIT at large bid.

I think that Furman has a much chance of winning the SoCon championship today as they did last Thursday. There is no such thing as a curse. Players don't care about things like that and pay no attention to it. That is a fan thing. The Wofford beat down was a terrible game for the Dins in almost every aspect and the net result is ONE LEAGUE LOSS. In this day and age of three point emphasis, this kind of thing is going to happen to everyone. It wont stop until the love affair with the 3 by coaches stops. We just have to accept it. Furman is as good as any of 6 teams and probably better than half of them. For some reason Furman came out Friday night without our usual defensive intensity, leading to a few easy in the paint baskets by a small WC team. At the same time, WC was playing inspired defense and we were ice cold. Some of the coldness was the result of poor shot selection and forcing shots. Panic set in to a degree and that was all she wrote. Anyone who has ever laced up a sneaker has been in one of those horrors. Murphy's Law applies and it is incredibly hard to overcome. But it is certainly not the end of the season. Everything that happened against Wofford is correctible. Defensive intensity is a must for this Furman team. Better shot selection on offense by everyone. Get the ball in the hands of the guys with the hot hand and take care of the basketball. Unforced errors with bad passing, poor ball handling etc. are killers. Lost possessions are lost scoring opportunities. They need to go out there and give Samford a good old fashioned beat down and get the damned MO-JO back. This is a balanced league with lots of inconsistent 3 point shooting teams. Nobody is going to get out of this season without getting some dirt kicked in their face. FU just had that joy. Now what? As one of my old coaches used to say "fughgeddaboutit and hit the friggin boards".

[Paul C]

After 7 SoCon games...record and KenPom rating...

2020: 5-2 #82
2019: 4-3 #96
2018: 5-2 #100
2017: 5-2 #128

Fallout? there is no fallout....we are still right where we want to be and every single goal is well within reach.

[apaladin]

After 7 SoCon games...record and KenPom rating...

2020: 5-2 #82
2019: 4-3 #96
2018: 5-2 #100
2017: 5-2 #128

Fallout? there is no fallout....we are still right where we want to be and every single goal is well within reach.

Previous years rankings really don't matter. We have fallen 24 spots the last 3 games(1-2). Fallout referred to the ramifications of the loss, not just ratings.

[apaladin]

For me, the most valid question about Furman MBB is: Can we win the SoCon Tournament this year?

Of course we all know the answer is no because the curse lives on. We have only come close a couple of times in 40 years. That is why we need to win as many as possible to possibly get an NIT at large bid.

I think that Furman has a much chance of winning the SoCon championship today as they did last Thursday. There is no such thing as a curse. Players don't care about things like that and pay no attention to it. That is a fan thing. The Wofford beat down was a terrible game for the Dins in almost every aspect and the net result is ONE LEAGUE LOSS. In this day and age of three point emphasis, this kind of thing is going to happen to everyone. It wont stop until the love affair with the 3 by coaches stops. We just have to accept it. Furman is as good as any of 6 teams and probably better than half of them. For some reason Furman came out Friday night without our usual defensive intensity, leading to a few easy in the paint baskets by a small WC team. At the same time, WC was playing inspired defense and we were ice cold. Some of the coldness was the result of poor shot selection and forcing shots. Panic set in to a degree and that was all she wrote. Anyone who has ever laced up a sneaker has been in one of those horrors. Murphy's Law applies and it is incredibly hard to overcome. But it is certainly not the end of the season. Everything that happened against Wofford is correctible. Defensive intensity is a must for this Furman team. Better shot selection on offense by everyone. Get the ball in the hands of the guys with the hot hand and take care of the basketball. Unforced errors with bad passing, poor ball handling etc. are killers. Lost possessions are lost scoring opportunities. They need to go out there and give Samford a good old fashioned beat down and get the damned MO-JO back. This is a balanced league with lots of inconsistent 3 point shooting teams. Nobody is going to get out of this season without getting some dirt kicked in their face. FU just had that joy. Now what? As one of my old coaches used to say "fughgeddaboutit and hit the friggin boards".

Jasper, I agree with what you say but FWIW, (not much) I felt the same about FU's tournament chances before last Friday. The only differenve is the chance of finishing one or two is even slimmer than it was if not totally gone. That in itself lowers the chances of winning the tournament to near zero.

[din23]

For me, the most valid question about Furman MBB is: Can we win the SoCon Tournament this year?

Of course we all know the answer is no because the curse lives on. We have only come close a couple of times in 40 years. That is why we need to win as many as possible to possibly get an NIT at large bid.

I think that Furman has a much chance of winning the SoCon championship today as they did last Thursday. There is no such thing as a curse. Players don't care about things like that and pay no attention to it. That is a fan thing. The Wofford beat down was a terrible game for the Dins in almost every aspect and the net result is ONE LEAGUE LOSS. In this day and age of three point emphasis, this kind of thing is going to happen to everyone. It wont stop until the love affair with the 3 by coaches stops. We just have to accept it. Furman is as good as any of 6 teams and probably better than half of them. For some reason Furman came out Friday night without our usual defensive intensity, leading to a few easy in the paint baskets by a small WC team. At the same time, WC was playing inspired defense and we were ice cold. Some of the coldness was the result of poor shot selection and forcing shots. Panic set in to a degree and that was all she wrote. Anyone who has ever laced up a sneaker has been in one of those horrors. Murphy's Law applies and it is incredibly hard to overcome. But it is certainly not the end of the season. Everything that happened against Wofford is correctible. Defensive intensity is a must for this Furman team. Better shot selection on offense by everyone. Get the ball in the hands of the guys with the hot hand and take care of the basketball. Unforced errors with bad passing, poor ball handling etc. are killers. Lost possessions are lost scoring opportunities. They need to go out there and give Samford a good old fashioned beat down and get the damned MO-JO back. This is a balanced league with lots of inconsistent 3 point shooting teams. Nobody is going to get out of this season without getting some dirt kicked in their face. FU just had that joy. Now what? As one of my old coaches used to say "fughgeddaboutit and hit the friggin boards".

Jasper, I agree with what you say but FWIW, (not much) I felt the same about FU's tournament chances before last Friday. The only differenve is the chance of finishing one or two is even slimmer than it was if not totally gone. That in itself lowers the chances of winning the tournament to near zero.

We're tied for 2nd place, one game back from first place (a team that we've already beaten), and our chance of finishing one or two is totally gone? Your negativity knows no bounds!