Spring Football Schedule

[Paul C]

Of all the issues I think Hendrix leaving was the catalyst for the decline.

[Furmanoid]

CuriousFan - I think I know what you're talking about…

COncerning recruiting - some of the issues we're talking about are moot now. CCH and staff are clearly recruiting high-academic players most of the 12 commits of 2021 have multiple Ivy and Patriot offers.

I don’t see how that makes it moot. Wouldn’t it be better to compete for JMU/ NDSU type kids instead of Brown/Lafayette type kids? I’m not saying to go straight up USC, but those fb guys I tutored back in the 80’s were smart enough. OK basketball was a different story.

[The Jackal]

CuriousFan - I think I know what you're talking about…

COncerning recruiting - some of the issues we're talking about are moot now. CCH and staff are clearly recruiting high-academic players most of the 12 commits of 2021 have multiple Ivy and Patriot offers.

I don’t see how that makes it moot. Wouldn’t it be better to compete for JMU/ NDSU type kids instead of Brown/Lafayette type kids? I’m not saying to go straight up USC, but those fb guys I tutored back in the 80’s were smart enough. OK basketball was a different story.

We had a commit from a kid who flipped to JMU.

Now he’s a backup at a D2 program. So, that’s not a panacea.

[AstroDin]

Furmannoid… I don't really want to hijack this thread into to much of a recruiting thread. But I will give you an example.

Bryce Stanfield
6-2 250 DE Acworth, GA
Total offers: 25 offers
7 FBS offers:
Sunbelt(Coastal, Charlotte, AppST, GaSo)
MAC (Akron)
ACC(Wake)
Army
FCS offers:
Ivies (Princeton, Yale, Columbia, Brown, Harvard)
CAA (Nova and UNH)
SoCon (Wofford, Mercer, WCU, and Chatty)
MVFC (SouIl)
OVC (Austin Peay, JakSt)
BigSouth (Campbell)

This IMO is the ultimate sweet spot example of Furman under CCH recruiting. Stanfield's first offer, let me say again first offer was AppSt. Bryce wants to be a dentist - my guess is Furman was very attractive for a lot of reasons for Bryce. Academics, proximity to home, Program tradition, Pre-Med program. When you can offer these types of things - you have a great shot at a player with 25 offers and my guess is a JMU/NDSU offer wouldn't sway him at all.

Another example but with some twists…

Myion Hicks
5-11 220 RB/OLB Dallas, TX
Academic All-State
2x District Defensive Player of the Year
2x First-team All-State LB|LB/RB/ATH
Total offers: 10
FBS offers:
AFA, Navy
FCS offers:
Ivy (Cornell, Columbia)
OVC (APSU)
Patriot (Georgetown)
SoCon (Wofford)
Northeast Conference (Sacred Heart, Bryant, Wagner)

Barring any unforeseen circumstances, Hicks will be a great running back for Furman. My guess is Myion only entertained high-academic schools (SMU showed him early attention).

Why I said the academic issue is moot - obviously CCH and Staff know the box they're working in and we're doing very well in getting commits from high-academic guys that are also athletes. It's not just Ivies that are recruiting… Tommy Beuglas, Landon Whittemore, John Ferguson, Christian Paraison. The four I just listed have a combined 70 offers - including a power five offer (Maryland).

[Furmanoid]

I think we went down this rabbit hole to explain the drop off after Ingle Martin left. Nobody has mentioned the possibility that we dropped off because Ingle Martin left. At the time it looked like a HS quarterback playing in a Pop Warner league. That covers up lots of problems.

If we can win a national championship with dental students and nuclear physicists, great. Nobody else can, but maybe we’ll set a trend.

[AstroDin]

I think we went down this rabbit hole to explain the drop off after Ingle Martin left. Nobody has mentioned the possibility that we dropped off because Ingle Martin left. At the time it looked like a HS quarterback playing in a Pop Warner league. That covers up lots of problems.

If we can win a national championship with dental students and nuclear physicists, great. Nobody else can, but maybe we’ll set a trend.

come on are you serious? I give you an example of a guy with a lot of FBS attention and you pick on…
so based on your point of view guess we can't win with guys like this too???

Landon Whittemore 6-4 220 TE Lafayette, TN
#4 ranked TE in Tennessee
Total offers: 23
FBS offers: UAB, Eastern Michigan, Ark ST, AFA
FCS offers: SoCon, Richmond, OVC, Big South, Ivies

Tommy Beuglas 6-1 230 ILB Buford, GA
Total offers: 20
5 FBS offers 1 Group of 5 offer: Maryland
Multiple offers from: SoCon, Ivy, OVC

[The Jackal]

I think we went down this rabbit hole to explain the drop off after Ingle Martin left. Nobody has mentioned the possibility that we dropped off because Ingle Martin left. At the time it looked like a HS quarterback playing in a Pop Warner league. That covers up lots of problems.

If we can win a national championship with dental students and nuclear physicists, great. Nobody else can, but maybe we’ll set a trend.

Martin helped, but it wasn't just him.

Remember, in 2003 and 2004 Bobby Lamb still had a large chunk of Bobby Johnson's defense. In 2003, Furman surrendered 14.1 ppg. In 2004, 16.6 ppg. Martin didn't play defense, of course (though he did punt).

After Johnson's players started to graduate, Furman's defense did a swan dive. Our annual ppg output jumped to the mid-high 20s. Last year's team was the lowest ppg (20.2) output of any Furman defense since that 2004 team. I bet we beat that mark consistently going forward.

Now, is that a fair comparison? Maybe not. The SoCon was an odd league in those days, with three elite teams in then a lot of crappy programs. There is a lot more balance now.

I think you can also point to the coaching. Lamb missed the playoffs in 2003 with an excellent defense and no QB. He had two excellent seasons with Martin, but then essentially became a .500 coach for most of the next 15 years with the single exception of the one season Mercer played in the Pioneer League. Fowler never really seemed to get things going.

I hate that Reese Hannon played on some really bad teams. He was such a good player, but his time at Furman just fell during the wrong era. He'd be excellent with this coaching staff.

[The Jackal]

I think we went down this rabbit hole to explain the drop off after Ingle Martin left. Nobody has mentioned the possibility that we dropped off because Ingle Martin left. At the time it looked like a HS quarterback playing in a Pop Warner league. That covers up lots of problems.

If we can win a national championship with dental students and nuclear physicists, great. Nobody else can, but maybe we’ll set a trend.

come on are you serious? I give you an example of a guy with a lot of FBS attention and you pick on…
so based on your point of view guess we can't win with guys like this too???

Landon Whittemore 6-4 220 TE Lafayette, TN
#4 ranked TE in Tennessee
Total offers: 23
FBS offers: UAB, Eastern Michigan, Ark ST, AFA
FCS offers: SoCon, Richmond, OVC, Big South, Ivies

Tommy Beuglas 6-1 230 ILB Buford, GA
Total offers: 20
5 FBS offers 1 Group of 5 offer: Maryland
Multiple offers from: SoCon, Ivy, OVC

You will never convince the perpetually dissatisfied to be anything other than perpetually dissatisfied.

[Davemeister]

Martin helped, but it wasn't just him.

Thank you.

The 2004 and 2005 teams were loaded with good players at all positions, a number of them All-SoCon and All-American.

Ingle was the tip of the iceberg.

[Furmanoid]

I think we went down this rabbit hole to explain the drop off after Ingle Martin left. Nobody has mentioned the possibility that we dropped off because Ingle Martin left. At the time it looked like a HS quarterback playing in a Pop Warner league. That covers up lots of problems.

If we can win a national championship with dental students and nuclear physicists, great. Nobody else can, but maybe we’ll set a trend.

come on are you serious? I give you an example of a guy with a lot of FBS attention and you pick on…
so based on your point of view guess we can't win with guys like this too???

Landon Whittemore 6-4 220 TE Lafayette, TN
#4 ranked TE in Tennessee
Total offers: 23
FBS offers: UAB, Eastern Michigan, Ark ST, AFA
FCS offers: SoCon, Richmond, OVC, Big South, Ivies

Tommy Beuglas 6-1 230 ILB Buford, GA
Total offers: 20
5 FBS offers 1 Group of 5 offer: Maryland
Multiple offers from: SoCon, Ivy, OVC

You will never convince the perpetually dissatisfied to be anything other than perpetually dissatisfied.

OK, I’m convinced. I don’t want to see anybody use “ high academic standards” as an excuse ever again. Agreed?

[The Jackal]

Martin helped, but it wasn't just him.

Thank you.

The 2004 and 2005 teams were loaded with good players at all positions, a number of them All-SoCon and All-American.

Ingle was the tip of the iceberg.

When you watched the 2003 team, you could tell we had a very good team and no capable quarterback. Furman went 6-5 that year behind a defense that gave up about two touchdowns a game.

That stat, to me, has always been incredible. I will never really understand how you go .500 with a defense that held 7 of its 11 opponents under 14 points. Only 3 opponents managed 20 - Clemson, Georgia Southern, and UTC. UTC got to 21 in garbage time in a game they lost by 42.

Martin filled in the only glaring hole on the roster - we didn't have a quarterback.

[The Jackal]

I think we went down this rabbit hole to explain the drop off after Ingle Martin left. Nobody has mentioned the possibility that we dropped off because Ingle Martin left. At the time it looked like a HS quarterback playing in a Pop Warner league. That covers up lots of problems.

If we can win a national championship with dental students and nuclear physicists, great. Nobody else can, but maybe we’ll set a trend.

come on are you serious? I give you an example of a guy with a lot of FBS attention and you pick on…
so based on your point of view guess we can't win with guys like this too???

Landon Whittemore 6-4 220 TE Lafayette, TN
#4 ranked TE in Tennessee
Total offers: 23
FBS offers: UAB, Eastern Michigan, Ark ST, AFA
FCS offers: SoCon, Richmond, OVC, Big South, Ivies

Tommy Beuglas 6-1 230 ILB Buford, GA
Total offers: 20
5 FBS offers 1 Group of 5 offer: Maryland
Multiple offers from: SoCon, Ivy, OVC

You will never convince the perpetually dissatisfied to be anything other than perpetually dissatisfied.

OK, I’m convinced. I don’t want to see anybody use “ high academic standards” as an excuse ever again. Agreed?

I've been guilty of making excuses for Furman's recruiting. It is true, there are a lot more D1 programs than there used to be. We still have higher academic standards for admissions than most.

Hendrix is proving that those are just excuses.

[Furmanoid]

Not sure he’s quite there yet. I’m just saying if we don’t contend, don’t blame academics. We’ll have to go with injuries and cheating refs.

[youwouldno]

Martin helped, but it wasn't just him.

Thank you.

The 2004 and 2005 teams were loaded with good players at all positions, a number of them All-SoCon and All-American.

Ingle was the tip of the iceberg.

When you watched the 2003 team, you could tell we had a very good team and no capable quarterback. Furman went 6-5 that year behind a defense that gave up about two touchdowns a game.

That stat, to me, has always been incredible. I will never really understand how you go .500 with a defense that held 7 of its 11 opponents under 14 points. Only 3 opponents managed 20 - Clemson, Georgia Southern, and UTC. UTC got to 21 in garbage time in a game they lost by 42.

Martin filled in the only glaring hole on the roster - we didn't have a quarterback.

Wasn't Stepp on the roster? My recollection is that he went on to do very well at the D-II level.

[The Jackal]

Martin helped, but it wasn't just him.

Thank you.

The 2004 and 2005 teams were loaded with good players at all positions, a number of them All-SoCon and All-American.

Ingle was the tip of the iceberg.

When you watched the 2003 team, you could tell we had a very good team and no capable quarterback. Furman went 6-5 that year behind a defense that gave up about two touchdowns a game.

That stat, to me, has always been incredible. I will never really understand how you go .500 with a defense that held 7 of its 11 opponents under 14 points. Only 3 opponents managed 20 - Clemson, Georgia Southern, and UTC. UTC got to 21 in garbage time in a game they lost by 42.

Martin filled in the only glaring hole on the roster - we didn't have a quarterback.

Wasn't Stepp on the roster? My recollection is that he went on to do very well at the D-II level.

He was a freshman, I believe. Both he and Bo Moore split time.

Neither was particularly efficient nor especially adroit at not throwing the ball to the other team. We had 8 passing touchdowns that year and 9 interceptions.

We probably had 3 or 4 losses that year where any sort of consistent offensive output would have resulted in a win. We scored 6 against Wofford, 9 against the Citadel, and 10 against App State.